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Theology in Americas churches.
What do people think of what they are being taught in many of the churches in the USA?
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on -
that is actually not your opinion jesse, rather it is fact.a sad one at that. but very true. in the usa we have made regular worldly people that want to live in sin christianity. churches now adays teach that love is telling people the feel good things and never opening there eyes to the harder facts of the way that we live our lives. when is the last time wee have heard that sin leads to death and death being eternal tourment in hell? when is the last time we have walked into a church an truly heard christ mentioned or heard a good testimony of what he has done in ones life? when is the last time that we have heard to give up all of the physical things of this world? when is the last time we saw a church that has not been made into a buisiness?
there are many false doctrines and prophets in the usa today. take for instance joel olsteen. have you ever heard him tell people what they really need to hear in order to edify a mans soul and spirit? i have not i have heard him tell people by your own positive thinking or many of you will be blessed with a raise at your jobs because you are saved. where is any of this found in the word of god? its not.
i love your post jesse and thank you for sharing it with me. the true church is in the hearts of those that have accepted jesus christ as lord and saviour. there for the true believers will see the scripture in the same light. therefore there is no denominations, rather believers and non believers.
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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you are right we should have our faith in christ through the hard times and that being in a positive heart process knowing that he is faithful and just to take care of us.
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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shai, sorry i did not get a chance to finish my thought concerning what you wrote. i do agree that benny hinn is another one that we all need to watch very carefully. however i think that we all need to be very careful with anyone that is preaching the word of god. many will throw a few scriptures in to make it sound like there is the truth. but be very careful because many are twisting the word of god to what they want it to say and not what is truly stated in it. this is dangerous espeacially in todays world. where people are being taught that authorities are correct and are not to be questioned. this cauing many people not to study th word on their own, basically. because they are told not to.
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Permalink Reply by Scott Johnson on -
Having spent most of my life being involved with "Spirit-filled" believers, I have found one major underlying frustration. Most Christians in the U.S. and elsewhere cannot get what they believe to work. That is the heartbreak of most Christians.
We know the Bible is true. We momentarily experience "peaks of power," but on a daily plane we do not experience as much consistency of workable truth as we desire. Therefore, we give ourselves to extremes. For some people, it is the total denial of the power of God; for some it is sensationalism, for others legalism; and there are hundreds of other "defense postures" we adopt all because we cannot get what we believe to work.
Answers are no better than opinions until they are proven to work! As leaders (and we all are) we need to quit giving people what we heard from the last preacher who "appeared to have it all together." We need to first learn to apply truth to our own life, get it working, then confidently stand before the people and say, "Follow me. I do not have an answer; I have a solution."
In my book, Breaking The Cycle of Defeat, I address this frustration that many are experiencing in their lives. What is needed today is a message that works, a "Livable Christianity"!
The church here in the U.S. and abroad have become laden with formulas, church covenants, church government and other religious activities that we have shut God out of our lives. In many ways without realizing it we fall to a "works righteousness" which moves us further and further away from the simple Gospel.
In our day it is easy for many to fall prey to something that looks good and symbolizes the real or genuine. In the book of Revelation, Jesus is seen knocking at the heart door of every believer. "Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me." Rev 3:20. This is not a verse written to the lost person but to His church. The only reason a person knocks at a door is if it has been closed. Our hearts are closed because we have turned away from the truth to an imitation that looks real but in the end is a counterfeit that produces no power to live a life that is victorious.
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Permalink Reply by Aliyah on -
I totally agree with you brother, and I wish above all that, as children of the only true God, through Jesus, we will seek after the heart of God to come into closer relationship with Him. It is our individual duty as followers of Jesus to seek to know Him through reading His word, talking to Him on a daily basis, worship Him in our hearts and lives and just enjoy His presence as we listen to Him speak to us. This should be our lifestyle. It is in this lifestyle that the Spirit of God will pour out into us revelatory truths and insights in giving us understanding thereby transforming our minds to the likeness of Jesus.
The heart of God is crying out to His people, "Please allow me to move, please allow me to reach others!" If God cannot move the way He wants to move in His Church, then He will be blocked from reaching the world. The church comprises of each person, and each person really needs to get back to a personal relationship with God (knowing God for ourselves) and renounce the spirit of religion. God, in His word, said, "If my people (the church), who are called by my name will humble themselves, turn from their wicked ways and pray, then I will hear from heaven and heal their land (the things going on around us in the world).
We have to be careful too, brothers and sisters, to use the word of God as a mirror unto ourselves and not to condemn others, for God did not come into the world to condemn the world but that the world may have life through Jesus. If you see your brothers or sisters doing something wrong, pray for them instead of telling everyone else what they are doing. Remember the word of God said that there is life and death in the power of our tongues, and we will have to give an account for every idle word at the day of judgment. Our words should only build others, not break them down. When we gossip there are two spirtual principles at work, "The power of our words (which sends forth life or death) and the power of agreement (whether it be good or bad, if two or more agree on something then it is done)."
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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i definately agree with this aliyah. we should also confront our brothers and sisters in their wrongs. it should never be taken behind there backs to others. we can ask others to pray for them and think that we should.
but in todays world it has become all buissness and everything against christ rather than all about christ and his moving in our lives. we serve an awesome god but we deny him when we get caught up in falseness or the things of this world. i am not saying to quit working our jobs and just go out there doing nothing. i am saying that we should wisely consider our needs and wants and throw the wants away. we should also go out and do the works of the lord. healing, evangilizing, edifgying one another and bringing people to the knowledge of christ rather than the knowledge of this world.
i believe the scripture that i am talking about is found in 1 thess. 5:16-22.
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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i agree with what you are saying here. however it goes a little deeper than this with what is being taught in our schools and churches. it starts in the minds of children and grows them into adults believing these false messages. faith in christ is thwe only method that works.
there is no formula that comes with it. it is simply that people have been taught that they can have cake and eat it to. they are taught that thay will be rich and prospering is in material things of this world. then when people dont get what they want then it becomes a lack of faith. we cant want the things of this world and the lord as well.
this is not to say that we will not be blessed with some material pocessions. but we should not be in want of these things and our mind set should definately not be all buissness and money. the lord will give to us our need and that for the better of souls in this world not for the better of our self.
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Permalink Reply by Aliyah on
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Exactly what I am saying brother, but in a different sense. If we make it our lifestyle to seek God's kingdom first, then, as His word said, ".....all these things will be added onto you." Besides, the Spirit of God will lead us into all truths, and when we seek Him with all our hearts we will find Him.
I also agree with you on people dwelling on the gifts and not the giver; which may cause their focus to shift from carrying out the great commission of Christ for us to go into the world and make desciples, teaching them whatsoever He commanded us, in building His kingdom for His return.
I pray that people will turn back to the true root of the gospel of Jesus. The root that man has fallen from God but God has sent His only son into the world to die for our sins , so that we may be redeemed back to the Father and be saved from eternal damnation. The root that we are saved by the grace of God when we have faith in Jesus, believing what He did, confessing our sins as we turn from them and receiving Him into our hearts and lives.
If there are false teachings in the church, what are we going to do about it? If together we have compared and contrasted what is happening in the church with the word of God and the Spirit of the word and find that there is a problem, then where do we go from here? Is there a people, a place or a thing that we need to take to God in prayer? Then, let's do it in love. God's eyes are not closed. He is well aware of what is happening in His church, and just like He spoke to the seven churches in the province of Asia, through John
(in Revelation), who made himself available to God, He is still speaking today.
Some may be blinded to what's happening, and are therefore complacent, but thank God for the few whose eyes are open to the truth.......let's put on the harmor of God and battle against the devil, using the word of God and prayer, starting from where we are (our family, church and community). For it is the devil we fight against, and not flesh and blood.
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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awesome post sister.
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Permalink Reply by Scott Johnson on
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I thought I would shake things up here a bit and address an ongoing conversation that I have been having via e-mail with some folks here in the Denver area. Also, it gives me an opportunity to stand up on my own soapbox about some things which I consider important. I'll probably raise some feathers with this post, primarily because this is how the majority of the church believes, which is also why I believe many are not experiencing God's power on a more consistent basis.
When people are first saved, they usually experience an immediate change in many areas of their lives. Often, however, these changes are very short-lived. We start out as new believers knowing and realizing His grace and power, we see God manifesting Himself in real and tangible ways. The difficulty comes as we begin to move away from simply believing and trusting in what God has already provided to us to where we are now performing to "get God to move in our lives".
If you will take the time and allow the truth of what I am saying reach your heart, it will open up a whole new world to you in your life. You will begin to see greater manifestation of Gods grace in all area's of your life. Why? Because we are embracing what God has already provided in the present tense rather then to some moment in the future. There is a big difference and the results will be evident as you experience more of Him on a daily basis in your everyday life.
Here in the Denver area we are getting ready for Christian event which I have no problems with. What I do have problems is the language we often fall prey to within Christian circles... Let me first show you an image of an ad I received via e-mail and the conversation that followed... It might get a bit lengthly here but I think it will be beneficial to you if you take the time to read through to the end.
Someone wrote me with the following question to this advertisement....
IS THIS BIBLICAL???? Praying for God to come down and forgive us and heal us?
Here is my answer....
In answer to your question, the truth of the matter is that God has already provided
everything that we have need of. When Jesus cried out loud from the cross, "It is
Finished" it meant that He had satisfied everything that God required.
The Good News Message is that God's wrath has been completely satisfied
against mankind and the only sin that stands between Man and God is the sin of not
accepting this good news message for ourselves in the present tense.
For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that whosoever BELIEVETH
shall be saved." John 3:16
"BELIEVE on the Lord Jesus Christ, and Thou Shalt Be Saved." John 3:14
Healing is no different or any other provision that came as a result of the perfect sacrifice
of Jesus.
The Good News is that the WAR IS OVER, The VICTORY has ALREADY been WON!!
We now approach God with thankfulness and joy because he has meant every need that
we have.
The Good News is that God's kingdom has come. It is this kingdom that is now expressed
in and through the life of the believer. We now walk in the same authority that Jesus walked
and call those things done as though they were and expect the manifestation.
The lie of the enemy is to keep us from living fully in the provision that is already ours.
If he or the lie of religion can keep us reaching out as it were to some future point
for our miracle of deliverance, he knows that he has succeeded.
If we would take the revelation of what is already ours in Christ and apply it to our lives with as
much vigor that we approach some of these meetings. We would have far less stories of casualty
within the rank and file of God's people.
I'm after a livable Christianity that can only be experienced by embracing what is already ours.
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Permalink Reply by Scott Johnson on
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Here is a response from one person who I copied and e-mailed this to...
I believe most of these folks know and believe “IT IS FINISHED” on the Cross by our precious Lord and savior and any one of them could have written your dissertation. There are powerful things the Lord has ordained in this City in the next four months, bringing down the walls that have divided us and His name is being proclaimed in the market place and in the governing places and it is a Body of Christ thing, not my thing nor your thing. His name is going to be exalted throughout this City in the next 4 months like never before—there is going to be radical praise and worship and declarations of His finished work on the Cross and the present power of the Holy Spirit in the open places that will fill the city, the atmosphere, the hearts with the beauty of His holiness.
Here is my response to this persons comments...
If they described it as you have just described it, that would be fine. The problem
is that much of our languaging in the church misrepresents what we truly know to
be true.
This in the end leads the uninformed into a works mentality and eventual burn out.
I am tired of seeing this take place in the lives of good sincere folks. It has brought
nothing but weakness and powerlessness in the church which makes us non-effective.
This stuff isn't just in the Christian Cliche we use but it is mixed into the languaging of
our sermons and our music.
As an example:
I had a personal pastor friend who sent me about some prophecy (a lot of this stuff comes
from Chuck Pierce and the Elijah list) But it said the following.
“There are new assignments at your gates. You need to be watching and contending.
There is a strong breastplate of righteousness that I must put on you now so that you
have strength to resist."
I wrote back....
Is this breastplate of righteousness that God wants to put on me better then the one I have now?
Maybe this prophecy was met for non-believers... do you think?
Sure seems like the church is always trying to get something that they already have doesn't it.
A new outpouring
Getting healed
The new anointing
Revival
More of you Lord
Double portion
Satan's defeat
Pray for God's blessing
etc. etc. etc.
Should we just wink of at this and pretend that it doesn't have a terrible effect on people lives.
Maybe we should put disclaimers and issue Christian Glossaries to new believer that let's them
know that when we make such ignorant statements that "We really don't mean it" but... "this is
what we really mean".
After saying all of this, here is the amazing part about it... God will still show up in our ignorance
as we try to function in the knowledge that we currently have.
Amazing isn't it!
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Permalink Reply by chris overy on
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scott, we still need to repent and turn away from our sins. the problem in america is that people believe in christ for what they can gain in worldly things. take for instance, the prosperity gospel. it tells people that they will gain all kinds of great worldly power and material things. the promise that we have from god is that he will meet our need. the second problem is that jesus christ has been taken out of the seat of authority in the churches today.
have you ever noticed that when people try to minister to others in this country they never speak about what christ has done, but man their churches are having all kinds of great activities going on. the problem is they are all worldly activities.
i went to talk to the pasture of the church that i am going to to start a worship night at the church. his response was that not enough people would show up to this. the bible that i read states that wher 2 or more are gethered in jesus name he is in the midsdt. a good church in todays world is look how manyu people we attract, rather than look how many lives the lord is changing through his power and his working through us.
the gospel in america is very false and gives people hope in this world rather than hope in christ.
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